In this first episode of the year, guest host Dustin Ramsdell speaks with Katie Munshaw to wrap up our episodes featuring the 2025 blogging team. They discuss how to lead with vulnerability and what makes it especially important when working in the residence halls. Katie shares reflections from her own life that have reinforced these lessons as well as encouragement for how others can find the right balance of how to do the same.
Guest: Katie Munshaw (she/her), Residence Director, Roosevelt University
Host: Dustin Ramsdell, Independent Higher EdTech Content Creator
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Transcript:
Dustin Ramsdell:
Welcome back everyone to Roompact’s Res Ed Chat podcast. If you’re new to the show, every episode our team of hosts brings you timely discussions on a variety of topics of interest to hired professionals who work in and with university housing, residence life, residential education, et cetera. So this, if you’re following along, is the final episode of the 2025 Roompact Blogging Team kind of get-to-know-you episode. So always kind of a fun tree for me.
It’s become a bit of an annual tradition to feature all the writers and their kind of diverse backgrounds and interests and topic areas that they’re creating content around and to provide another way for the community to engage with them. So Katie, if you want to kind of kick us off as we usually do, just kind of briefly introduce yourself and give an overview of your background and then we’ll get into more of what you joined the blogging team and talking about our topic of today about kind of leading with vulnerability.
Katie Munshaw:
And thank you, Dustin. Hello everyone. My name is Katie. I am currently a residence hall director at a really interesting university in downtown Chicago. It’s Roosevelt. It’s mainly the whole residence hall is in the top 15 floors of a sky rise building so I have a really interesting experience. And before that, I was a residence director for a couple years at another university, and then a graduate residence director before that, and an RA before that. So that’s kind of what my experience has looked like.
Dustin Ramsdell:
Yeah, just living the res life life. Then it’ll be interesting, I guess, seeing how your experience is certainly where you are now at being such a unique context, how that is interwoven into our conversation today. Because that almost does feel like it’s a little bit like a separate episode of like, it’s a residence hall, but it’s in an urban environment. It’s also like the top floors of a bit like very interesting stuff.
But regardless, we’re here obviously again, it is sort of like get to know you stuff and kind of elaborating or providing another opportunity on topics that all the writers have been creating some of their content around. But if you can think back, we’re recording this at the end of October of 2025 towards the tail end of your tenure as a part of the blogging team. But if you think back, what inspired you in the beginning to want to join the Roompact Blogging team?
Katie Munshaw:
Yeah. So the reason I decided to apply is because, to be totally honest, I felt like I was losing my spark a little bit for residence life and higher education, losing my motivation and interest. So I was reflecting on that and what I wanted to do and I realized I needed to take a little of my own medication. I’m always preaching to students to get involved and find community and how that can help create a sense of purpose and where they are and whatnot. So I thought I might need to get involved with the Res Life community as a whole.
And that’s honestly why I decided to apply. And I will say it’s been really beneficial for me personally in my own professional life, and remembering why I got into this role, and why I wanted to work with students and specifically in Res Life, which can be such an interesting experience as many of us know. So yeah, that’s why I chose to apply and I’m happy I’m here.
Dustin Ramsdell:
Yeah, yeah. And I mean, and we always do a good job at curating a diverse group of people in terms of like the types of institutions they’ve worked at, their tenure in residence life, and that sort of thing. So I think it just adds a lot of great voices into sort of conversations through the content and everything and engaging in the community. And I think there’s like a way where I’m sure it’s probably helping you to normalize the good and the bad because I think just you might be able to kind of talk shop with colleagues at your institution, but then you don’t know if it’s like, well, is this sort of how it is other places? There’s just like aspects like that.
And then I know for me, I’ve done a similar 10 years with writing where it’s like, if you are having ideas or like it just, it allows you to sort of think about and reflect on the work in such a different way because you’re kind of trying to connect dots and convey it in a format and way that sort of people can get and understand. And yeah, I mean, I thought it was interesting just with at least like the conversations I’ve had with the other writers, what you kind of proposed of speaking for this conversation around leading with vulnerability kind of felt uniquely complimentary and different from the things that we were talking with the other writers about. So we’ll start with a very high level question. What does leading with vulnerability mean to you?
Katie Munshaw:
Let me start by not totally answering your question, but I think that leading in vulnerability is something I have thought a lot about as someone who’s younger in their career. I started out as a graduate residence director and I directly oversaw RAs who were one year younger than me. So it was kind of a unique experience in trying to be this professional. I needed to take on this professional version of myself. And I found that when I took on this persona that was the leader, the boss, I started losing myself and who am I when I lead? And so that’s something I’ve reflected on as I’ve been in this role longer for a few more years.
So I think to me, leading in vulnerability is really embracing who I am, my genuine self, and taking that into the role, and being willing to admit my mistakes when I make them because we’re human and so it’s okay to make mistakes. And I think that’s a powerful thing to do as a leader and take accountability for those kind of things. And then as well as like leaning into the unique parts of myself that are maybe different than other leaders. I’m really silly and I think it’s good for me to lean into being really silly and stuff, because I think that sets a powerful example in our students, not to get ahead on questions, but I think that’s important for people to see that it’s okay to be you and the unique self that you are.
Dustin Ramsdell:
Yeah, yeah. We’ll definitely elaborate on some of those pieces of like… So I always think about that when I’m thinking of questions like, are you going to put one in there of the like so what factor of like, because it could be like, oh, this is all good ideas and thoughts and theories and whatever else. Let’s really kind of like bold circle, underlines like, this is important and this is why so we will definitely get to that. But I think a lot of this it’s like just using kind of words I guess that feel as best fit as possible of like, because there’s just like authenticity would be just another kind of interchangeable word here, but the vulnerability is acknowledging mistakes, like acknowledging when you don’t know something, but obviously it could be like, well, I will look into that for you.
And it’s not just like certain things of being like, “Well, just do this because I say so,” or, “But it’s just the way it is or whatever.” That’s even something when I think about it is like, yeah, there’s like the big authenticity piece that you were sort of elaborating on and are sort of, we’re good at some things, not so good at others, whatever, that’s part of it. And then, because I think I’ve known it about myself is that I always really appreciate sort of context of things. So I guess that idea of not always just operating from a place of power and that idea of just it being like you do it because I said so and there’s like, that’s the way it is and whatever.
It’s like, “Hey, I’m going to be vulnerable.” It’s like, “Hey, I know this is probably difficult to understand,” whatever, but we have these rules in place and this is how it is. And that’s just part of being in a community is that you sometimes need to make sacrifice. It’s kind of that idea of like empathy would even be just another kind of interchangeable action word here is like, I think vulnerability gets a bad rap for that idea of like, “Oh, you’re weak or something else like that.” It’s like, no, I think it’s a lot about just sort of bringing in emotions in a productive way into our working lives when that seems like there’s just traditionally been a lot of resistance to that and things.
So I do think it is a very powerful way to show up certainly in education environments and certainly even more so in residence halls because people are living there and there’s just a whole another layer of things. So I don’t know if just your quick kind of perspectives, and certainly we can name-drop particular resources and things here or later. But how do you feel like listeners could foster more of this into their work and kind of make it feel more, I guess, natural or more kind of like a habit?
Katie Munshaw:
I feel like a very common person that people like to recommend is Brené Brown. I think her stuff has really helped me learn more specifics about how to lean into vulnerability so that’s my suggestion to look into that. But I think another thing is that we are always getting to know who we are. So you’re on this continual journey of like, who am I? Which feels weird because you’re with yourself every day, but that’s just how it is. You grow and you change and you need to be able to lean into knowing yourself because it’s hard to be vulnerable and genuine when you don’t know who you are.
So I would encourage people to self-reflect often and then in that self-reflection, like take that to work, like who am I? Let’s be that person at work. And then this is something that I always tell my RAs as well is lean into the awkward. I think that being vulnerable can feel awkward and that’s okay. Lean into that. Be your awkward self sometimes because it can be hard to be transparent and to admit things that are difficult, but yeah, lean into that. So that’s my advice, self-reflect and be you.
Dustin Ramsdell:
Yeah. And I think maybe sit with this for a moment too, because yeah, I think Brené Brown is definitely like the kind of very popular kind of preeminent scholar. She’s producing a lot of content on this. I know she has a podcast and many books and I think you can’t go wrong with any of her things. So I think that is a blanket advice recommendation or kind of resource recommendation. But yeah, I think it was coming up for me before when you were talking about, and it’s coming up again now, so I want to make sure I don’t lose this train of thought, but that idea of like how you’re talking about like, oh, in your early career, you felt like maybe you were…
The sense I was getting was that you were sort of like performing the boss and I think that idea of like, okay, self-reflections, well, reflect about what? It’s like that idea of like when you think of a leader, like air quotes or whatever, what is that and why do you think that? Because I think that is like people kind of put a mask on or do whatever else and it’s like, yeah, maybe only until it’s too late, do you realize how exhausting that is? Is it like, oh, I’m not doing this my way. I’m doing it the way that I think I’m supposed to based on like our parents or teachers that we have, all this sort of formative people that we look up to or authority figures or whatever else.
And I think you can sort of like put them all into a blender and come out the other side with something that’s good. But I think it’s when people haven’t done any sort of like scrutinizing or evaluating of like, “Okay, what is my idea of a leader? Why do I think that? And is that something that I feel like I want to authentically and genuinely embody?” And I think, yeah, you can start to even do small doses, I guess, of certain things. And I think, because it’s even like, there’s a lot of aspects to this, and I’m sure we’re not going to get to all of them in depth in this episode, but that idea of like what you wear, your attire, does that feel genuine or like just how you speak or just how you engage with people.
There’s a lot of details here and you can start kind of like, okay, maybe I’m going to dabble here, dabble there, see how it feels and whatever else. But because I’ll just put this back to you because it’ll feel like sort of a good prompt, I guess for furthering this point. But I think another kind of critique or kind of eye rolling that people might do with this is like, if things that like, okay, if I’m showing up vulnerably or leading with vulnerability or being authentic in my working life, then it’s like I’m just like opening the floodgates. It’s all everything all the time. There’s like no guardrails.
So that’s why I think some people are like, “We’re not going to do that. I’m just going to let anybody know all my business or whatever.” So I don’t know if there’s any thought on that because I think that is sometimes people’s problems with these sort of things is that you’re going from like zero to a hundred and it feels so disruptive and that I guess it’s trying to like, I guess get your response to that idea of like, well, you maybe need to start kind of dabbling small and dipping your toe in with this before you go too far and it feels like really disruptive or foreign or kind of like negative. So any just thoughts on that of the kind of iterative approach that you could take to leading more with vulnerability?
Katie Munshaw:
Yeah. I have a thought about that specifically thinking about like the opening the floodgates and being too much and like warning going to be a little more serious here. But while I was leading a staff of RAs, at one point in my life, I was undergoing chemotherapy for cancer and not easy thing to do and I didn’t take a break from work. I kept working through it, but that was a situation where I knew it was going to be helpful for me and my team, for my team to know what was going on, but it’s also a balance because the people I’m overseeing, these student leaders, right, they’re not there to support me. They’re not my support network.
So it was important for me to share with them like, “Hey, I’m going through something hard and in my life, this looks like every other Friday I’m not available, don’t contact me during that time.” I was able to set up some boundaries and also be vulnerable when like, “Hey, this was a hard week for me with treatment, just so you all are aware. I might take me a little longer to get back to you,” things like that. I wasn’t saw being in my staff meetings telling them, it’s not that kind of vulnerability. I was doing that with my close friends.
What I found was my student leaders were really appreciative of knowing, “Okay, this is what’s going on in Katie’s life. We can give her a little respect and a little space when we need to,” but I wasn’t overwhelming them with things happening with me. So I think that was a really intense maybe lesson and version of like leaning in vulnerability while also not pouring all my sorrows onto my staff because I don’t think that is an appropriate way to handle things either. So I think that’s answering your question of like opening the floodgates. Yeah, I’m not coming in with all these details about what’s going on, but also being able to update them on like, “Hey, great news. I’m in remission now and they can all celebrate with me.”
I can share some hard things in my life and some great things in my life while keeping more of the details for my friends and family that are my support system. So that’s kind of how I’ve learned to balance that when I have something hard. I let my staff know, “Hey, I’m going through something hard right now. Give me a little space, a little room.” And then they can see someone that hopefully they look up to at least a little bit handling difficult things because they’re going through difficult things, too. And it’s helpful to see adults handling hard things and how they’re handling those. That’s kind of how I’ve managed that and dealt with that because I think I’ve handled it really well, to be honest. And I think sharing things and working with them like that has been really good.
Dustin Ramsdell:
Yeah, I appreciate you sharing that because I do think it is like a really kind of compelling example and in a way it kind of like forced it because I think it would have been so difficult if you just sort of like completely closed off that to everybody because it’d be like just a lot of questions and worrying and wondering and whatever. That idea of what he tells to me and he has to like to put it succinctly is the idea of like that you are honest without being overly specific. And I think that’s kind of like the kind of recipe here is the idea that you could say like, “Hey, I’m going through some medical treatments and things that’s going to require some stuff for me, whatever.”
And it’s like, “I’m being honest. I don’t need to, I’m not required to or whatever, be any more specific than I care to be.” But I think that that is a part of people’s lives that just whatever it might be is a great kind of framework to sort of think about this and be like, “Oh, okay.” Because I could totally understand I think that this topic could feel somewhat abstract and very ambiguous to people because there’s so much to us about our families and maybe medical stuff or whatever else that there isn’t ever going to be a strict kind of line, but it’s like, “I know when I see it.”
Or just for you, you kind of feel it in your gut of like, “I don’t think this is something that I’d want to share or whatever else.” And I think as you start to do it, there is also just going to be this sort of gauging and reflecting on the response that you get from people. I’m sure as you were being more honest about something that you were going through that people were appreciative and could show up in the way that you wanted them to versus you were sort of going it alone or people felt like you were hiding something or not that idea, something that just kind of creates barriers or whatever else that shouldn’t need to be there.
But then you did still want a boundary somewhere, but not this sort of arbitrary area over there because they felt like they couldn’t ask about something. So I think that is a good way example to have folks take some inspiration from and good on you, I think for sharing that with our audience here, but also just, like you said, the way that you went about it, you can kind of reflect on it and feel really good about that. I think it was something that I’m sure was difficult, but was worth it to kind of navigate versus…
Because I think there is sort of a, I’m sure for some people, it just feels easier in a sense to just like never be authentic and never share anything like whatever else, but it’s like, well, then it just makes it harder in other way, just choose your hard or whatever, the sort of phrases that people use and stuff where it’s like, “I’d rather people know that I’m going through something.” I don’t know.
So I think that there is a decent amount of friction or headwinds or kind of hurdles that get put in the way of doing this, but I think you just kind of have to start on the path and to kind of segue to the question we were using before, know that it’s worth it because I think it is important when it comes to working with students and colleagues. So if you just want to kind of say a final thought on that on why doing this is important for when you’re working with your students and for when you’re working with your colleagues.
Katie Munshaw:
Yeah. So I think as far as students go, be yourself because there might be a student that really sees themselves in you and that can be really inspiring. I think just based on my own story, like I’ve talked with a lot of students who have different chronic illnesses and talked to them about, yeah, the RA role is something you can balance and I can use my own story to talk with them about that kind of thing. But yeah, I think that leaning into who you are can help the students feel empowered to be who they are.
When people have talked to me, I don’t think I’m the kind of person that could be a student leader because X, Y, Z. And it’s like, no, that’s not true. That’s not true. We don’t want these cookie cutter versions of people in our student leaders. And I think everyone would agree with me on that. We also don’t want those cookie cutter kind of people in our professional staff. We need different voices and whatnot. So yeah, leaning into who you are and being able to admit where your mistakes are so your colleagues can come in and help you with the things you’re not as good at.
And being able to open up about those kind of things is important, because in the long run you’re going to get a lot more done and be a lot more efficient if the people around you know who you are and where you need support and where you thrive. So I just think in the end the connections are going to be so much better when you’re vulnerable with the people around you, when you lean into who you are as a person, and that just creates a better environment for everybody. So that’s what I’d say.
Dustin Ramsdell:
Yeah. I mean, I think that is a good succinct way to put it, is that like everybody’s just going to work better together if they know where your strengths are, where your weaknesses are when it comes to colleagues. And then that authentic connection piece, like the idea that you could bond on something with like a student that you’re working with or student staff, certainly also applicable there. But I think that idea of like, “Oh, you’re somebody that I trust or somebody that…” I just feel like I have a connection where like, “I’m going to listen to you when you’re trying to get me to do something.” Putting it in such a simple and clear way, I think hopefully that kind of resonates with folks.
And as we close out, any final bits of advice or resources? Another one that came up for me and I think is sort of a school of thought that the Brené Browns of the world has come from is like positive psychology, another just sort of great area to look into for this kind of topic here. Anything from your perspective, your experience, advice and/or resources that you’d want to share on this topic to close us out?
Katie Munshaw:
Yeah, I think I’ve already said it, but continual self-reflection and then talk to people who you’re close to who really know you and ask them questions about yourself. I know it sounds weird, but the people who you spend the most time with, they know who you are and ask them and help gain understanding from the people that you’re really, really close with so that you can continue to be yourself. And I think that just lends itself to leading in vulnerability. So that’s what I’d say.
Dustin Ramsdell:
Yeah. Well put and I think an important topic and one that I think just confronting or kind of interfacing with sort of head on here where I think it’s been interwoven some other topics in the podcast here, but appreciate you sort of embracing it, sharing your experiences and your thoughts and resources and all that good stuff and appreciate you being part of the blogging team. So we’ll have ways to connect with you in your work in the episode description, but yeah, just thanks so much for hanging out and sharing all that you did.
Katie Munshaw:
Of course. Thank you so much, too.
